long term prepping

[grenfell]

I liked BSTS's thread about the specific scenario so I'll put forward something similar.
Most on here seem to have one eye on some form of economic crash or down turn. I tend to believe that is the most likely scenario , whether it is caused by peak oil, solar flares destroying our systems or just the inherent flaws in our economy coming to the surface. I also tend to think there will be a recovery but not to former levels followed by another crash a bit harder and so on but with the general "line on the graph" being downward.
There seems to be a feeling on the net that prepping should also mean preparing to help not just ourselves but the next generation, so the question is what preps should we put in place for the long term.
For myself I would say fertile land , buildings and knowledge would be important , money in the bank less so. I think the previous generations had probably better skills for adaptation , were less reliant on technology and more prepared for hard work ( by previous generations I mean those that grew up pre 60's ) .My own generation (I'm in my 40's) has lost some of their attributes and those younger seem to be losing a bit more (this is a generalisation, an average if you like, I'm aware their are 18 year olds more practical and able to adapt than their grandparents) so I think it's imperative to pass on as many skills and as much knowledge as possible.
As to what to stockpile, food and fuel won't last decades but things like tools, fixings, wire and hard to manufacture goods could be worthwhile as their value will appreciate. Imported goods may be worth stockpiling should global trade close down. For example simple things like cotton sheets. Cotton doesn't grow in this country and sheets would become something of a luxury item simply because of their rarity. Blankets on the other hand wouldn't be as important to prep as sheep live quite happily here although providing for our population would be a problem.
Any thoughts?

[preppingsu]

I always think books.
Books that show you how to do things without the modern technology we rely. Books that show you how things were done in the 'good old days', from preserving what you go, to making your own soap, to folding a terry nappy!

The younger generation (in fact many in our generation) will not know how to do these things and the generation that could do them (my gran) are no longer around.

[triffid]

Books good, but knowledge/experience even better!
If I can explain. ( My user name is 'TRIFFID' taken from 'The Day of The Triffids' by John Wyndham. A bible for us preppers IMHO)
For me, the 'means' of the disaster in the book (satellites/ blindness/man eating plants etc) is academic - the lesson to be learned is just how 'thin' the veneer of civilisation is, how 'society' can break down and how individuals/groups can survive. The narrator (Bill) is concerned with the survivors futures... Chapter 15 if you're interested.
ie How hard it is to learn farming from a book (dvd's/ internet even harder if no electricity etc! ) Frankly unless you have the basics (NOW) of how to grow food you are unlikely to be able to do so WTSHTF.


So knowledge is the critical thing. In the book the survivors can plough by using existing tractors etc. But what will they do when the tractor they have breaks down? OK use another one..... but when the final working one breaks will they have the skills to repair it. And if they do have the mechanical skills will they have the necessary skills to forge parts & if they do will they have the skills to smelt iron to make the parts?
Our society is one based on specialisation ie we all do what we are best at. But in a societal collapse maybe, just maybe, the most successful people will be the generalists ie those that can turn their hands to whatever is needed.


IMHO the thing is to learn to be a generalist. Grow food (tick). Hunt (tick). Build structures etc (tick). Electricity (tick). Mend/make clothes (tick) etc

[Ferricks]

I agree with all previous posts here and I can add only one further that I believe to be integral to long term planning.

As you all rightly say, prepping for the long term hinges on knowledge and learning, I think the points made about "generalism" are incredibly useful and I would use my evening tonight as an example. Tonight, my husband, myself and six year old daughter all made sloe gin together. Myself and youngster pricked 3lbs of sloes with needles and my OH sterilised jars and dragged forgotten bottles of booze from the back of cupboards to make rumptoffs. Learning and "doing" as a family (or group) at any age is really important - Fiona is six, (amongst many other things) she can identify a blackthorn bush, knows that Sloes can only be eaten (or drunk!) if processed in jelly or otherwise, and that jars have to be sterilised carefully using boiling water or a heat source before anything can be stored in them.

We try to do things together as much as we can and also include others - my Dad's a dab hand at chopping pumpkins for chutney....

By working together in units now (family or otherwise) we're creating another layer of insurance - importantly, we can work together but we can also cover for each other if we need to because we have shared skills. I think that learning together works well and offers a real future for us all. I'm actually in the middle of setting up a skills sharing group in my local area on this basis and I think it also creates a network of like minded people - always handy to know a few people with extra skills and there's no need to share our personal motivations .

In terms of what things to "keep" for the future - I would agree on good fabrics/linens for bedding, towels, curtains for insulation etc. Also glass jars, bottles, preserving items that could be difficult or expensive to replace and really good, hardwearing footwear - a loft full of wellies could be priceless in the future!

[Steveo82]

What a scary thought. If it happens in 20 years time the pre 60s/70s generation will be gone.

[preppingsu]

That's a great post Ferricks, I love the fact you have started young with your daughter teaching her skills that will stay with her. Unfortunately, my mindset changed as my children were hitting their teen years and I have struggled to encourage my children to get involved.
I talk about why I do things, my daughter does know her way around the kitchen but chooses not to, my son knows basic DIY ( thanks to his Dad) but relies on electrical items whereas my OH uses hand tools.

I will endeavour to continue to drip feed information about how to do things but the books I collect will help them if I am not here to pass on that information. I regret not learning more off my nan; she did everything from scratch right into her 90's. I now use her preserving pan but I have had to teach myself. She tried to teach me to knit but I wasn't interested at 12 but now I need her expertise as I find it hard to teach myself to knit/crochet.

Maybe the way forward is to produce a handbook of the way we do things so we can pass it on to our children and grandchildren and share our knowledge with them.

[grenfell]

That's a great post Ferricks.

I fully agree, passing on or at least trying to pass on skills and know how is probably our most potent weapon . I try to teach my daughter as much as possible and I'm perhaps fortunate that she enjoys learning , of course I can't interest her in everything but anything is better than nothing. I'm a bit like preppingsu in that I now wish I'd paid more attention as a child especially to a great uncle I had.
Triffids point about farming is a good one , perhaps keeping knowledge of horses or looking at alternatives in the same way Cuba has had to reorganise since they have been deprived of cheap oil.
The comment about books is very valid too. Sure they take up a lot of space , are slow to access , and need a stable environment but other forms of storage aren't fool proof. Digital storage has the ability to outlast a book but will we have the ability to read that information in the future. I've read about early computer tapes that are obsolete and can't be accessed. It would be possible to rebuild the systems to read them but no one is going to spend the money to do so. A similiar and more domestic situation is the disappearance of VHS videos. There are still videos around but the players are getting rarer. We did a clearance some time ago and there were Betamax videos and even a Philips 2000(?) . Basically junk, try even giving it away!

[QUAID]

knowledge is definitely the key to long term... I fully agree. Knowledge is power.
Books are a must.

Its very interesting to see the BBC team that did
Victorian Pharmacy / Edwardian Farm / Wartime Farm etc

The skills used in their programmes are what we must learn, but these are fading.

I think the American prepper networks are far more experienced than in the UK. The upcoming generations are losing touch with nature rapidly.

[spare tyre]

It frustrates me that my generation just don't care. I can cook, garden, grow food, carpentry, bush craft, metal work, brew, first aid, natural mediciens light fire, identify coastal foods (from home) plan, bassically survive. most youth can't even look after their bank account. its sad.

[grenfell]

Am I right in assuming you're younger than me spare tyre? ( I'm late forties).
Still the younger generation can beat me hands down at wiping out zombies or driving high speed sports cars or piloting spaceships or a million and one other things on a computer screen