Stove boiler plumbing advice needed

[handyandy]

Im working away building (with tiny budget!) my new house and,in the spirit of using mostly recycled,scavenged materials etc
I picked up this Doric stove/cooker with back boiler for £80 off gumtree
Im wondering if any plumber types out there would know how many radiators this would heat?
thanks in advance
Andy

[poppypiesdad]

Depends on certain things

Whats the output of it ?
Whats the size of the radiators you've got are they doubles or singles ?
Are you wanting to heat a thermal store or just to pump it round the house ?

j

[handyandy]

thanks for quick reply.
Tbh this thing is ancient so ive no idea what the output is (as in btu's,kw etc).iv currently searching around trying to find specs.
Rad wise ive a load lying about 2xdoubles at around 1200 long and a shedload of various sized singles
Im looking to heat both rads and a hot water tank (which will be upstairs)
as house is off grid im hoping to use a 12volt pump,wondering if this would do the job
being more into the building side rather than plumbing side of things im trying to get my head round the whole heating system thing!
House is 1800 sq ft (bungalow but with attic trusses) 2 bedrooms upstairs of 25 sq mtres each and open plan down stairs.
Passive solar heaters will be used on south facing wall to 'top up' house heating and im sorta overdoing the kingspan so house will
be very well insulated

[poppypiesdad]

Never ever over kingspan it , we finished a 160sq m bungalow in may ish time

100mm under the underfloor heating
85mm in the cavity

We currently sit around 21 oC during the day , with no heating the boiler is on 2 hours in the morning , and 4 hours at dinner time

Right back on track #

Difficult one this , how you going to get your u values for it to comply with building control , understand what your trying to do , do you have a building warrant , if so who did the heating calculations , did they include this .... is this supplemental, or is this it ?

what height are the 1200's?
j

[ForgeCorvus]

I will say thats a great score you got there.

When you say your place is open-plan downstairs, thats like one massive living kitchen with a bathroom off it ?

Because even a small range will heat a large airspace, meaning that you might only need rads in bath and bed rooms.



Don't forget back-up heating*
I grew up in a house with an Aga that also ran the central heating, coldest Monday morning of my life was when the bottom grate gave up the ghost on a Friday in January and the system cooled to ambient over the next two days....Brrr



* I know, I needn't of mentioned it.......This is a Prepsite after all

[handyandy]

1200 rads are 600 high as are most of the single rads I have lying about.
yeah my then architect submitted all to building control but it was for standard oil fired central heating with
dear as hell condensing boiler etc etc but iv mentioned to building inspector (when he came out to inspect subfloors before I concreted)
about my recycling/off grid intentions and hes pretty chilled out about it as house is for me rather than to sell on so he knows im going to
try my best to do it right!lol
floor will have 100mm sheet insulation under screed,roof trusses 100mm kingspan or similar between trusses with further 10 or 15mm over whole upstairs living area under plasterboard as per building regs.and cavity filled with bead insulation
tbh ive made a shed load of changes to the house to make it simpler and cheaper to build and building control are good with that and are happy to leave me
to my own devices!
tbh even planning weren't bothered about me proposing a green roof rather than standard tiled roof in submitted plans
guess im lucky theyre so easy going!

[handyandy]

I will say thats a great score you got there.

When you say your place is open-plan downstairs, thats like one massive living kitchen with a bathroom off it ?

Because even a small range will heat a large airspace, meaning that you might only need rads in bath and bed rooms.



Don't forget back-up heating*
I grew up in a house with an Aga that also ran the central heating, coldest Monday morning of my life was when the bottom grate gave up the ghost on a Friday in January and the system cooled to ambient over the next two days....Brrr



* I know, I needn't of mentioned it.......This is a Prepsite after all

aye downstairs is open plan,kitchen dining right round to living room with bathroom and just one other room on ground floor.
yeah I was hoping the stove would heat the downstairs combined with the solar heaters and im also putting in underfloor heating pipes
to be used at later stage with water source heat pump...if I ever figure out a diy solution!
the way I see it,it can never be too warm,i can always open a window anyway!
would luv an aga but don't have the budget!

[preparedsurrey]

Hi,

I'm not a plumber but I do have experiance with solid fuel central heating. That stove is probably the same as the old Aga's they will happily do a hot water cylinder and possibly one rad or two small single rads, anything else will be asking too much, if you have a look at the size of the boiler you will probably find it is a really really small box, rather than a full water jacket type.
If you are plumbing it up you need to make sure you arrange it so you have a gravity based system* and be aware building regs say no valves are allowed on a solid fuel system in case of their failure (I know you can spend all day arguing the toss with building control about this point as you can have valves that can only fail in the open position so aren't a danger). The no valves bit makes it a pain if you are going to use solid fuel as well as gas or oil.....
All the hot water piping out of the boiler must have a constant rise (no level or downhill sections) to the highest point in the system (usually the hot water cylinder) then fall back to the lowest point - which is your boiler - in this way you will not need a pump (or electricity) to make it work.
Getting this right takes some thinking about and planning but it is possible to fit a full central heating system to a large house in this way and get it to work without a pump

*as water heats up it expands becoming less dense - therefore in simple terms hot water rises, colder water falls

I agree with what has been said about insulation the more the merrier we have 150mm of kingspan in our extention roof and 100mm of kingspan (not Jablite/ polystyrene) under the screed of the floor which has underfloor heating laid in it, once hot in the morning it retains heat most of the day.

We currently use a log burner with a chimney through the centre of the house which basically acts as a giant storage radiator once up to temperature and warms 3 rooms upstairs and the hallway enough to not really need the central heating on.

[handyandy]

Hi,

I'm not a plumber but I do have experiance with solid fuel central heating. That stove is probably the same as the old Aga's they will happily do a hot water cylinder and possibly one rad or two small single rads, anything else will be asking too much, if you have a look at the size of the boiler you will probably find it is a really really small box, rather than a full water jacket type.
If you are plumbing it up you need to make sure you arrange it so you have a gravity based system* and be aware building regs say no valves are allowed on a solid fuel system in case of their failure (I know you can spend all day arguing the toss with building control about this point as you can have valves that can only fail in the open position so aren't a danger). The no valves bit makes it a pain if you are going to use solid fuel as well as gas or oil.....
All the hot water piping out of the boiler must have a constant rise (no level or downhill sections) to the highest point in the system (usually the hot water cylinder) then fall back to the lowest point - which is your boiler - in this way you will not need a pump (or electricity) to make it work.
Getting this right takes some thinking about and planning but it is possible to fit a full central heating system to a large house in this way and get it to work without a pump

*as water heats up it expands becoming less dense - therefore in simple terms hot water rises, colder water falls

I agree with what has been said about insulation the more the merrier we have 150mm of kingspan in our extention roof and 100mm of kingspan (not Jablite/ polystyrene) under the screed of the floor which has underfloor heating laid in it, once hot in the morning it retains heat most of the day.

We currently use a log burner with a chimney through the centre of the house which basically acts as a giant storage radiator once up to temperature and warms 3 rooms upstairs and the hallway enough to not really need the central heating on.

Thanks for your reply.im doing diagram atm.i'll aim for hot water tank and 3 rads (all upstairs) and let gravity do the work but can easily fit 12 volt (boat pump etc) if circulation is a problem.yeah you are right water tank in stove isn't exactly huge.
Im going to use my tried and tested 'trial and error' method to fine tune a suitable heating system bearing in mind im building with pretty much no budget.
I'll post pics up of the results when I get it done.After I get the roof tiled/insulated
big thanks for replies

[ForgeCorvus]

The only reason the P's choose an Aga was because Dad bought one at Scrap value, it was in the 60's when people were ripping "Old Fashioned Junk" out and fitting "Nice Modern Stuff" in..... The same 60's NMS that people are ripping out and replacing with things their Grannie grew up with

The Aga (and its replacement Raburn) fed/feed a hot water tank thats directly above and three feet to the left of the range, just like the system that Preparedsurrey was talking about.

Handy: I don't suppose your chimney is in the centre of the house is it?


Damm it, now I'm doodling floor plans for the future prepstead