Preparing for Winter 2022/23

[Yorkshire Andy]

So no electric . Limited water no gas and upto our ankles is our own poo

More joyousness! I need to live long enough that at least one of my nephews is interested in prepping, and will see all my prepping books and stuff as useful, rather than as mad crap accumulated by the mad auntie

With that in mind, what does anyone think of this particular little Calor BBQ https://www.calorgas-heaters.co.uk/gas- ... cream.html Cartridges are a bit different from the norm too, although long term that might be a disadvantage. And since I wouldn't be having BBQs, it might be a white elephant for me, a very expensive one.

Although, I have a half made haybox: wooden frame, outsides made of vinyl flooring about 4cm thick, roof insulation for the sides, base and top, fabric surrounding the cast iron pan (pan is only medium size, but its a start).

Those bottles look like the ones my dad had in the 80"s for his blowlamp know he's got 3 on his shelf empty but he won't get rid


I got this one from Lidl

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Campingaz-Gril ... th=1&psc=1. Can grab pics tomorrow if you want but this has it covered : I paid £40 with a gas cartridge included


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KgfPhOBVz ... e=youtu.be


Cartridge type is widely available or was ....

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Campingaz-Cart ... 306&sr=8-3


You know the score More types of stove better the chances of getting a cartridge to fit at least one

I've got one to take most types as much as I hate them the humble bistro stove

https://www.amazon.co.uk/POWER-plus-804 ... 231&sr=8-6

Those "gas batteries" are available in most hardware shops although I find them crap they do work. By crap they don't like the cold and take ages to get a brew boiling and don't last long .... But £1 Ish a cartridge in B&M etc know 4 shops minimum I could go tomorrow and buy them....

That's before we get to the wood gas stove / Kelly kettle / bio ethanol / unleaded petrol stoves


The screw on threads are fairly common in a few sizes / shapes
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/184461190728 ... Sws~pfbKAv

https://www.winfieldsoutdoors.co.uk/out ... ckQAvD_BwE


Edit just been digging looks like dad's bottles are discontinued ... Bet he has a deposit on them

These are the 400g propane I think it takes these as there no clear description

https://www.travisperkins.co.uk/solderi ... g/p/555044

£10 a cartridge the Yorkshire man made me clench my wallet

[jansman]

You see what I did there? You are all coming up with ideas!

When I submitted the original post,it did cross my mind that it would be seen as doom and gloom,but ,personally,I see this a crisis unfolding in plain sight. The media and general population only see the high fuel prices.My own mother said “it’ll settle down,it always does” ,and that is the thought of most I reckon. Politicians across Europe - ours in particular - have swallowed the Net Zero ,Green bull sh*t ,hook,line,and sinker. Oil is getting harder to extract,gas is getting scarcer ( our own North Sea fields are all but played out - a domestic example) ,and coal is being dropped ; although the Germans are hanging on with that for at least another decade!

Mankind USED to live sustainable lives. We used renewables .Wood.However,man being man,we denuded the lands of trees.Then we started using coal ,which literally sparked the Industrial Revolution.Coal was energy- dense and created the complex industrial society we have now.In the early 1900’s ,coal production peaked,as a new ,even more ,energy - dense fuel was coming out of the USA ; Oil ,and in particular,diesel! Diesel runs the world .It powers trucks and tractors ,and literally puts the food on our tables - and it has to- as 350 years ago,before coal,we were an Agrarian Economy. Then a large chunk of the population left the land for the factories,and kept on doing so,so fewer people were supplying food to the masses. This situation was largely taken care of by early outsourcing of labour,to the British Colonies ,where food was produced cheaper,then transported by coal powered steamships,and onto the coal powered railways.

And so it continued ,to the point we are now at.We are a highly complex,industrial society,that is dependent on energy dense fuels to power that miracle ,which you must remember,has only been around for the blink of an eye in evolutionary terms.In the name of The Environment,and Climate Change,we are being sold the New Green Dream.We simply replace oil ,coal and gas with wind and sun - driven electric replacements.Sun and wind are not energy dense though.They are a direct result OF energy dense fuels in their manufacture and transportation. Governments are waiting for ‘Market Forces’ to develop a new energy - dense fuel source ; what Heinberg,in his book,Powerdown, called ‘Waiting for the magic elixir’. Climate change IS an issue,but I suspect that Peak Fuel is also playing a part in the decision to move to so- called renewable fuels.

In the week to Christmas,we had high pressure over the UK. This is a frequent occurrence now because of the movement over time of the Jet Stream.The wind only produced 6% of our needs. Gas and nuclear,then coal at Ratcliffe and Burton ,biomass in Yorkshire at the Drax station ,kept the lights on.Along with a percentage of imported gas and electricity. Wind works,when there is wind ,and solar at this time of year is a non- starter. What is apparent to anyone interested enough to tear themselves away from TV reality shows and TikTok ,is that we are now limping along,not striding ,in our efforts to power our Complex Society.

When,not if,we have to start rationing fuel ,then our economy will start to stall.Society as we know it now,needs vast amounts of reliable and cheap energy to function.Unless that Magic Elixir is discovered,then we will have to start Powering Down.That will have massive consequences for society.That ,however,is long - term.

Short-term will be making sure your basics are covered between power cuts.Two years ago there was a virus sweeping through China.Even our own government didn’t think it was an issue at that time.Forward to March 2020 ,a new phrase came into play : Lockdown. That caused massive panic buying, and the shops were stripped.I got caught out myself ( my energy was focused on my poorly wife at that time) ,even though it was a situation waiting to happen.
The same will happen with things like lanterns,batteries and other power-cut-related items ,as soon as the merest threat of power cuts is hinted at. Forewarned is forearmed.

[Yorkshire Andy]

The same will happen with things like lanterns,batteries and other power-cut-related items ,as soon as the merest threat of power cuts is hinted at. Forewarned is forearmed.

Went into home bargains yesterday and the household electric item isle was striped bare ..

Still plenty of batteries though by the till .... Plenty until you envisage the whole town descending on the place

Spread your assets out in terms of compatibility I've a torch / lantern that will take at least one of the common battery sizes from AAA to D to 6v lantern battery to cr2033 button cell so whatever I can get my hands on I've got something same with radios

I do need to stock up on petrol I use 15/ 20l per year on the allotment and the can is nearly empty

Same with the 10l of diesel I use for the diesel heater

[grenfell]

When I submitted the original post,it did cross my mind that it would be seen as doom and gloom,but ,personally,I see this a crisis unfolding in plain sight. The media and general population only see the high fuel prices.My own mother said “it’ll settle down,it always does” ,and that is the thought of most I reckon. Politicians across Europe - ours in particular - have swallowed the Net Zero ,Green bull sh*t ,hook,line,and sinker. Oil is getting harder to extract,gas is getting scarcer ( our own North Sea fields are all but played out - a domestic example) ,and coal is being dropped

When,not if,we have to start rationing fuel ,then our economy will start to stall.Society as we know it now,needs vast amounts of reliable and cheap energy to function

I don't personally see it as politicians swallowing an idea , more that they are grasping at the straw of BAU . As you point out fossil fuels are running out and even if we were to discount the pressing need to reduce emissions we would still have to adopt a lower energy density and in reality a lower energy usage. But telling people that their lifestyles are going to have to change and probably what they consider their standard of living is going to be lower isn't going to be popular and certainly wouldn't be a vote winner. So telling everybody we can just continue with barely a hiccup is deluding people. Then there's aspects some people find hard to grasp. Take electric vehicles. Ignoring all the strawmen arguments about not having a drive or whatever one thing people talk about is range . They see a short range as a negative but fail to grasp that a long range EV is counter productive. To increase the range in reality means bigger batteries which means a bigger vehicle , more materials , more embodied energy , more generating capacity to charge all those batteries and less inclination to use trains and public transport. It's not just politicians , it's the population as a whole who are living a dream.
Rationing , is something I've said should have been brought in some time ago TEQ's , Tradable Energy Quotas , an idea put forward a while ago but again swept under the carpet as it would be a vote loser. It has to come , I agree with you there, but will need cross party support which sometimes feels like asking for the moon.
As to what we do now in our own personal lives. Carry on stocking what we can , insulate what isn't insulated even adding curtains and pelmet to double or triple glazed windows can help , be prepared to wear more in the house , none of us have an unalienable right to wear shorts and tee shirt in deepest winter. Perhaps suspend any surprise and shock as we know what's coming and just be resolved to a simpler life.

[Arzosah]

Yorkshire Andy thanks for those links, I've saved them for later (don't have time to get them delivered here now before the petsitting gig). What it boils down to for me is to be able to cook something *easily* I have a little bistro stove, and I'll get more cartridges for that, but the one you've linked to looks a good size. That will mean I have the rocket stove, the bistro stove, the hexi (although very little hexi) and the half made haybox. The portable BBQ I linked to was £109 - for that money, I could buy the grill that you linked to, plus two sets of the cartridge sets. Sorted. I need something easy - my brother turns 70 next year, and I'm not that far behind, I can't be doing with gathering twigs for the rocket stove, unless it was literally life and death. Plus it enables me to look after my sister and my niece.

jansman as you know, I agree with that analysis. I'll do what I can, as long as I can, it's all *any* of us can do, actually.

grenfell sorry, I don't know what "BAU" stands for? And I just read the wiki article on tradable energy quotas - interesting! Massively open to abuse, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be done, of course.

[grenfell]

BAU business as usual .

[Arzosah]

BAU business as usual .

D'oh! Thank you! Yes, even though some of them are starting to see the issues facing us, they're just straws in the wind, and the overwhelming majority are, as you say, looking for business as usual. What they think are votewinners.

[GillyBee]

Votewinner is the important comment here.

People change their ways very fast when it it is to their benefit but will dig in hard if they are asked to give something up they think of as a basic right.

The solution the politicians will therefore use will be to allow things to fall to bits first. Given rolling power cuts and/or sky high bills,most people will change their energy usage habits pretty quick and will then consider anything the goverment changes as an improvement on chaos rather than loss of their right to unlimited fuel.

e.g.A thrift blog I follow had a recent Norwegian comment that a shower was now costing about 48 NOK or £4.00. Her household is moving to Navy showers/sponge baths instead of daily showering....

[jansman]

When I submitted the original post,it did cross my mind that it would be seen as doom and gloom,but ,personally,I see this a crisis unfolding in plain sight. The media and general population only see the high fuel prices.My own mother said “it’ll settle down,it always does” ,and that is the thought of most I reckon. Politicians across Europe - ours in particular - have swallowed the Net Zero ,Green bull sh*t ,hook,line,and sinker. Oil is getting harder to extract,gas is getting scarcer ( our own North Sea fields are all but played out - a domestic example) ,and coal is being dropped

When,not if,we have to start rationing fuel ,then our economy will start to stall.Society as we know it now,needs vast amounts of reliable and cheap energy to function

I don't personally see it as politicians swallowing an idea , more that they are grasping at the straw of BAU . As you point out fossil fuels are running out and even if we were to discount the pressing need to reduce emissions we would still have to adopt a lower energy density and in reality a lower energy usage. But telling people that their lifestyles are going to have to change and probably what they consider their standard of living is going to be lower isn't going to be popular and certainly wouldn't be a vote winner. So telling everybody we can just continue with barely a hiccup is deluding people. Then there's aspects some people find hard to grasp. Take electric vehicles. Ignoring all the strawmen arguments about not having a drive or whatever one thing people talk about is range . They see a short range as a negative but fail to grasp that a long range EV is counter productive. To increase the range in reality means bigger batteries which means a bigger vehicle , more materials , more embodied energy , more generating capacity to charge all those batteries and less inclination to use trains and public transport. It's not just politicians , it's the population as a whole who are living a dream.
Rationing , is something I've said should have been brought in some time ago TEQ's , Tradable Energy Quotas , an idea put forward a while ago but again swept under the carpet as it would be a vote loser. It has to come , I agree with you there, but will need cross party support which sometimes feels like asking for the moon.
As to what we do now in our own personal lives. Carry on stocking what we can , insulate what isn't insulated even adding curtains and pelmet to double or triple glazed windows can help , be prepared to wear more in the house , none of us have an unalienable right to wear shorts and tee shirt in deepest winter. Perhaps suspend any surprise and shock as we know what's coming and just be resolved to a simpler life.

I just listened to You and Yours,radio 4 ,about electric cars.Ironically,I was in the yard ,cutting firewood.As you mention,most of the callers were concerned about range. Only one caller asked the question,albeit within a sentence,”how are we to power all these vehicles?”

And I agree,we must be resolved to a simpler life.

[grenfell]

That question of how to power them would be more easily solvable if people were to accept cars with a maximum range of perhaps 80 miles tops and were to use trains or buses for longer journeys or for that matter even for short journeys too rather than expecting to have the unquestionable right to drive hundreds of miles. Even a bus full of people that gets milage only just in double figures is still much more efficient than each passenger driving their own cars no matter how efficient they are , petrol or electric. If we look at just how much of it's life a car is sat doing nothing , parked on a drive not moving it's probably over 90% for most cars which translates to an enormous amount of energy tied up for decades.