jansman wrote:If there is a gas leak/chemical cloud etc. we will stay at the outlaws round the corner. We had an armed siege a few years ago nextdoor. We were just told to stayinside. If the world goes to hell, then we stay HERE!
Why? Because it is ours. Outright. No way we will be refugees. The gvt. mantra is Go in,tune in, stay in. We are a small island. No where to run.
so you would do what the govt told you to do?? not me buddy, i wouldn't trust the govt(of whatever party) if they told me day was light and night was dark! they'll round us up and pen us in like a flock of sheep...and they're the wolves! me and mine are bugging out and taking our own chances, at least any decision on our future(or lack of it) will be our personal choice and not taken by some faceless civil servant who couldnt care less whether we live or die.
couldn't agree with you more here. if it were just a natural disaster then sure i'd go to a shelter for a few nights, that's fine
if it was shtf territory, and doubtful of any form of proper civilisation in the near future, no way i'd go with 'the authorities'. i would not want to be rounded up like cattle, shoved into a huge pen full of angry, terrified, hungry people in most likely very close quarters. the scenario in my mind leads to nothing but constant stress, constant fear, possibly getting very ill and being most likely treated very poorly at best. fair enough for those willing to do so, that just leaves more BOL for me
i plan to bug in as long as possible but bare minimum of 2-4 weeks if possible as i have a large food store, lots of local foraging and rabbits and a river within .2 miles of my home. i figure 2-4 weeks gives things a chance to die down and to see if it's beyond hope or if things might settle afterall.
should i have to bug out then part of my plan is to follow the railway lines a little back the wrong direction because within a few miles i happen to know of at least half dozen farms with horses. why walk? well i don't have a car, i don't need one and to be honest i wouldn't have money for prep items if i had to pay for all the upkeep of one. i CAN drive, i did drive for 15 years but i've lived well enough without one for the last 11 years and i am already accustomed to walking with a pack on my back, i do have some physical issues i'm working on now but i'm fit enough to travel 2-4 miles a day on foot if i really had to even now. i however am the only member in my group that can drive, also, i think obtaining cars would be the easy part (though not all that easy!), finding clear roads and not being obvious whilst driving, not so much! anyway i digress
i admit, i don't have tons of experience with horses but i believe i have enough to at least get one to accept a pack on it's back if not me or my group members, my grandparent had horses so i do have some experience with them. also some of these horses have dressage equipment outside so whilst they may not be accustomed to packs they will be used to people. if we get there and there aren't any horses left it's not a wasted trip as there also a few small organic farms near there so at least we could scrounge some food, i also have noticed a fair few places that would make good temporary shelters along that part of the railroad.
after obtaining horses (hopefully!) we'd follow the rail tracks back towards my house and beyond towards a selection of BOL i've already identified. i have four reasons for following the railroad
1. most people won't follow it and most rail lines are hidden away from public view the majority of the trip so it's more secure.
2. if you have a map with the lines marked no amount of removing street signs will make you get lost. sure they may take down some of the railstation signs but it's highly unlikely every single one would go and if you mark where you have passed on your map as you go you will already have a good idea where you are anyway. knowing my route by rail is an important part of my prep, i know local landmarks that help me identify location without need of signage. since no one will be out ripping the rail lines up in a shtf scenario, least not right away and even if they did the route would still be obvious for at least a few years before it was totally overgrown this seems a reasonably sound plan! don't get me wrong, i have half a dozen compasses (everyone in your group should have their own!) but this is far less margin for error.
3. railroads (in scotland at least where i live) tend to go through some very remote locations, places you would never see by car. this affords those traveling along these routes access to places that at the very least offer relatively secure temporary shelters and may even throw up possible long term locations that i was unaware of, pillboxes, old railstation buildings on long disused lines etc this also means that chances are far fewer people will have their eye on YOUR BOL if it's not closer to a road, most will be trying to use their cars (with i suspect, a certain amount of futility due to everyone clogging up the roads, roadblocks etc) i do realise there may be the odd train to dodge if for some reason they are still running (i would expect this to be by the military) so in tight spots we'd have to find a temporary way around so as not to be dangerously hemmed in but knowing where these places are is part of my prep too.
4. i often see a load of food i could forage when i am traveling by train. i've been foraging more and more over the last 5 years and if i can spot a decent amount of food on a swift moving train i can just about be sure there is even more available that i couldn't see in my quick passing by. i also frequently spot places where fresh water could be obtained, yes it may need some filtering and boiling or some sterilisation tablets but that's going to be par for the course in a shtf scenario anyway. as for the horses, well there is plenty of food for them all along the rail lines too!
i realise with horses and rail lines some spots could be tricky and might require a slighty circuitous route however if we did have horses available to use i think it would be worth it because even if we had to walk out of our way the amount of equipment the horses could carry would seriously help us to get where we needed to be with as much gear as possible in as best shape as possible and if it were to get very very very bad, i know from living in other countries where it is more acceptable that horse actually makes a very tasty food source though i qualify that by pointing out it would have to be extremely dire for me to do that, the horse(s) would be far more valuable in other ways and would likely become dear companions to all group members which would be a morale boost in an incredibly depressing scenario.
well after reading a few peoples bug ideas i keep on thinking erm! a few keep saying they will head to farms and do this and that !!! remember one thing! farmers have guns and we have the ability to use them!!!!!! we get a lot of practice shooting pests steal my live stock and you could be in a world of pain
tigs wrote:well after reading a few peoples bug ideas i keep on thinking erm! a few keep saying they will head to farms and do this and that !!! remember one thing! farmers have guns and we have the ability to use them!!!!!! we get a lot of practice shooting pests steal my live stock and you could be in a world of pain
well i personally would only take from places that are abandoned, i don't doubt i would be in a world of pain and danger if i p****d off some farmer and rightly so! personally i think evasion is better than confrontation, however if things are well and truly abandoned there is no harm in taking what you need. i realise horses may not work but since they are so close it seems foolish not to take a chance on it if it's feasible at the time. to me cars and the ability to drive without being seen as a target and without having to constantly have to get out and move abandoned cars around seems fraught with peril, i know i can't travel fast on foot yet but it's far easier to evade capture if you aren't on the open roads, suits my comfort levels better and i would find it safer to forage whilst walking the railway lines then whilst walking the roads when i couldn't move the vehicle i had to liberate any further due to lack of petrol or blockades caused by abandoned vehicles. i'd be too worried about people seeing me there. walking parallel may work for some but many roads here have irrigation ditches then either open field (no cover) or steep inclines with trees which would make walking the rail lines easier and safer, with or without horses.
personally i think bugging in is the best option for a lot of people IF they aren't under constant harrassment or threat from other people, i know if i lived in a big city i wouldn't dream of staying there long term but that's just me personally.
tigs wrote:well after reading a few peoples bug ideas i keep on thinking erm! a few keep saying they will head to farms and do this and that !!! remember one thing! farmers have guns and we have the ability to use them!!!!!! we get a lot of practice shooting pests steal my live stock and you could be in a world of pain
Im with you on that tigs I will be avoiding farmers as much as possible and always being polite to them when I do come across them.
Think the railway lines are a good idea if you can use them.
As for the horses does every one in your party know how to ride if not a bit of a time waster there not sure if I would want to see my kids carted off on a runaway horse. 2. how are you going to tie the pack on to them even if you get one that lets you 3. horses today are not use to seeing working horses and will pancik if they see something other than a rider on another horses back making them all panick. I know this for a fact as when I drive my pony for the first time on a new yard there is padamonam in the fields and the first time it happened to us completly upset my girl. Even puting a pack on a pony will cause all the others to go flighty even now three years down the line when I take my rubish up to the main yard( about onece in six months) on my girls back there is a lot of prancing and snorting about. My advice on horses is to get more of your party involved with them so that more of you know what you are doing with them one person trying to control panicking ponys/horses is not going to work
AREA's 5-6 and 4 Feet the original All Terrain Vehicle
Confuzzled wrote:if you aren't on the open roads, suits my comfort levels better and i would find it safer to forage whilst walking the railway lines then whilst walking the roads when i couldn't move the vehicle i had to liberate any further due to lack of petrol or blockades caused by abandoned vehicles. i'd be too worried about people seeing me there. walking parallel may work for some but many roads here have irrigation ditches then either open field (no cover) or steep inclines with trees which would make walking the rail lines easier and safer, with or without horses.
If you want to use the railway lines for mobility (I really like that idea) why not build a railway bicycle - there are some that just mount an existing bike - so all you have to do is store a frame. As far as I can tell it has all the advantages of a horse with none of the disadvantages. Here are some pictures at the link
tigs wrote:well after reading a few peoples bug ideas i keep on thinking erm! a few keep saying they will head to farms and do this and that !!! remember one thing! farmers have guns and we have the ability to use them!!!!!! we get a lot of practice shooting pests steal my live stock and you could be in a world of pain
well i personally would only take from places that are abandoned, i don't doubt i would be in a world of pain and danger if i p****d off some farmer and rightly so! personally i think evasion is better than confrontation, however if things are well and truly abandoned there is no harm in taking what you need. i realise horses may not work but since they are so close it seems foolish not to take a chance on it if it's feasible at the time. to me cars and the ability to drive without being seen as a target and without having to constantly have to get out and move abandoned cars around seems fraught with peril, i know i can't travel fast on foot yet but it's far easier to evade capture if you aren't on the open roads, suits my comfort levels better and i would find it safer to forage whilst walking the railway lines then whilst walking the roads when i couldn't move the vehicle i had to liberate any further due to lack of petrol or blockades caused by abandoned vehicles. i'd be too worried about people seeing me there. walking parallel may work for some but many roads here have irrigation ditches then either open field (no cover) or steep inclines with trees which would make walking the rail lines easier and safer, with or without horses.
personally i think bugging in is the best option for a lot of people IF they aren't under constant harrassment or threat from other people, i know if i lived in a big city i wouldn't dream of staying there long term but that's just me personally.
I would not horse-rustle unless you were 105% sure the farm was abandoned, some horses run £3000+
I have different bug out locations depending on the event, in the event of flood we have a location 198m above see level (highest point where i live) with forest area and for a secluded woodland with ample water and food sources
has anyone else checked out how high they are above sea level? or am I over prepping?
steal my live stock and you could be in a world of pain 
and always being polite to them when I do come across them.
he is more loved then me!!!