Legal or not

[Manclife]

I think the OP needs to clarify what he means by doesn't lock but won't close.

If the blade is held open by the handle then I agree its a deemed a fixed blade. If its just a case of it closes most of the way then the handle stops it shutting fully then I would say its legal.

[Colin KC]

Please understand that I do not wish to come across as argumentative, but, in UK law, there is little room for "in my opinion" or "as far as I'm concerned" or indeed "I would say"

If a folding pocket knife is incapable of being folded at all times, then it is no longer considered, in law, a folding pocket knife.

Any "mechanism" that prevents the blade from being closed renders it a locking knife.

[Manclife]

Then I'll support my argument.


A Crown Court case (Harris v DPP), ruled (case law). A lock knife for all legal purposes, is the same as a fixed blade knife. A folding pocket knife must be readily foldable at all times. If it has a mechanism that prevents folding, it's a lock knife (or for legal purposes, a fixed blade) The Court of Appeal (REGINA - v - DESMOND GARCIA DEEGAN 1998) upheld the Harris ruling stating that "folding was held to mean non-locking".

So it's a 'locking' knife that's illegal and not one that doesn't fold fully.

[Colin KC]

Show me the definition of "foldable" doesn't mean "able to completely be closed without release by mechanism" & I will be willing to concede, but until then, at least err on the side of caution, especially when it's advice that may see someone arrested by following it.

We live in interesting times my friend

[Manclife]

Really? I show you case law that says a folding knife is a non-lockable one yet you still can grasp that one that's had the lock disabled is legal. The definition is of what's legal it is therefore easy to extrapolate what's illegal.

[Colin KC]

The handles on a multi-tool that prevent the blade from closing is a mechanism & therefore it is a lock knife, whether the "proper" lock has been disabled or not. I'll concede that the OP has complied with the spirit of s139 & that would go a long way with PC Plod, but there's still a danger of CPS running with it & a court convicting, all based on the handle stopping the knife from closing.

[tanstaafl]

Interesting points all, but I think it is now legal as it is the same as any non locking multitool of this type.


Correct me if I am wrong but are not leathermen tools that dont lock considered legal, all I have done is make my leatherman into the same type.


Or are you saying that non-locking multitools are illegal because they have a handle stopping the blade closing ?????????




I will take my chances I think, as it is readily foldable without use of a mechanism

[SooBee]

Call it a coincidence but at the Craft Fair on Saturday, I had to ban the obvious display of a knife as a tool for the craft on display.
This was not because it was not a correct tool for the job or because it was inappropriate but because it occurred to me that the owner might not be the one who could use it inappropriately. In a crowded hall someone else could grab it and use it.

So the rules really do have to fit the situation too.


Soobee

[badgersden]

Call it a coincidence but at the Craft Fair on Saturday, I had to ban the obvious display of a knife as a tool for the craft on display.
This was not because it was not a correct tool for the job or because it was inappropriate but because it occurred to me that the owner might not be the one who could use it inappropriately. In a crowded hall someone else could grab it and use it.

So the rules really do have to fit the situation too.


Soobee

why did you ban a tool at a craft fair which was perfectly legal for the use it was intended for and where it should be displayed and explained to the other craft fair people how to use it ,also why do you think someone will take the item and i presume you thought the said person would go on a stabbing rampage
are craft fairs a hive of illegal activity's such as mass stabbing,personally i think you were over zealous and you are showing what a crazy nanny state country we have become.

[SooBee]

Would you place a very sharp knife where a child could get hold of it?

I have to think of general safety and make my decisions carefully. I always do this by discussion with the stallholder.
I have enough training to recognize dangerously unhinged persons and remove them if they start to misbehave.
The knife was placed in a toolbox where it could be used for teaching purposes if anyone had asked.
The problem was that it was on open display where it was not under close control of the stallholder (in his hand).

I am also old enough to be a nanny.


Soobee