Advice for a hopeless gardener

[diamond lil]

Jansman can you grow tatties in the shade? I've no room apart from one patch that only gets the early morning sun and then that's it for the day. Faces due east in a corner of wall and fence. Wonder if a few tubs in there might work?

[jennyjj01]

Jansman can you grow tatties in the shade? I've no room apart from one patch that only gets the early morning sun and then that's it for the day. Faces due east in a corner of wall and fence. Wonder if a few tubs in there might work?

I'm going to be controversial. Please humour me. Starting from the worthiness of growing the noble spud.

I googled " What vegetables to grow UK " because I have my own thoughts on what is and isn't worth the effort and groundspace. And I'm just not getting it, for me. Spuds were a top recommendation of one site But that seemed to be based on a massive yield, without reference to how cheap they are in the shops. Similar with carrots.

I'm really at odds with the idea of putting effort and resources into 'low monetary value' crops.

YES. I would change my attitude if the shops stopped supplying staples so cheaply!

With limited ground area, and zero expertise, I tried to weigh up the pros and cons of various things to grow.
Here are my thoughts, applicable to ME. Your Mileage May Vary.

If I have a try at spuds or carrots, it will be on a small scale just to see if I can do it.

Am I being totally wrong headed here? Spoiled by our easy access to food?

Crop	Shop Price/kg	Yield by Area	For	Against	Observation	In my plan?
Garlic:	£Stupid/kg	Medium	Long Harvest Season		Easy to grow a small crop	Yes
Herbs:	£Stupid/kg	Low	Easy to grow		Worth a small patch	Yes
Strawberries:	£5.00/kg	Low	Delish	Need lots of care	I haven't succeeded	Yes
Spring Onions:	£5.00/kg	Low/Medium?	Easy to grow		Worth a small patch	Yes
Chard (or similar):	£3.00/kg	High	Fast growing		Not to everyone's taste	Yes
Green Beans:	£3.00/kg	High			VFM, but I don't like them	No
Courgettes:	£3.00/kg	Low	Staple		Not to everyone's taste	Yes
Beetroot:	£2.50/kg	Medium	Fast growing		Not to everyone's taste	Yes
Tomatoes:	£2.50/kg	High	Easy to grow	Need some care	High value Staple	Yes!
Beansprouts (mung):	£2.50/kg	High	Grow on demand		It's a crop	Yes
Leeks:	£2.00/kg	Low	Easy to grow		Worth a small patch	Yes
Lettuce etc:	£1.50/kg	Low	Fast growing	Need some care	Not my staple	No
Onions:	£1.25/kg	Medium	Long Harvest		Absolute staple	Yes
Parsnips:	£1.00/kg	Medium	Long Harvest		Not to everyone's taste	Yes
Spuds:	50p/kg	High	Staple	Risk of lost crop	Why bother	No
Carrots:	40p/kg	medium	Staple		Why bother	No

Any thoughts or additions? Arguments?

[diamond lil]

I've just always grown my own tatties, I like having them

[jansman]

Jansman can you grow tatties in the shade? I've no room apart from one patch that only gets the early morning sun and then that's it for the day. Faces due east in a corner of wall and fence. Wonder if a few tubs in there might work?

They will grow in partial shade Lil. Some sunlight is needed. I only grow spuds in containers, and mine get about five hours sun a day. I get enough from a 12” pot for one meal for two as a rule. Here’s a link:

https://greenupside.com/can-potatoes-gr ... they-need/

[GillyBee]

Grow Your Own Vegetables by Joy Larkcom has been my guide for years and includes a value to space guide. I too have limited growing space so my personal rules run as follows:

Normal times: Grow for fun & to learn. Grow things that might be expensive or which are simply not often seen in the shops. e,g, I grow Oca which we eat at Christmas but is never seen in the shops round here. Easy to grow but not a good return for the space committed. New potatoes are very expensive early in the season but a couple of pots of Rocket or Swift in a greenhouse is very achievable and makes for a treat. Maincrop needs too much room. Have you seen the price of a couple of sprigs of rosemary or parsley in the supermarket? I usually grow a selection of herbs, raspberries, tomatoes, beans, courgettes and a few squash. Anything that grows vertically (or can be made to grow upwards) is good in tight space.

SHTF times: I intend to convert the lawn and flower beds to produce food and aim to produce as much nutrition as possible in the space. This is when I would want to grow maincrop spuds, parsnips, carrots, beans and anything with a lot of nutrients/calories for the space needed and is otherwise not to be had. The hard bit will be realising I need to convert the lawn (& persuade the family) in time to plant which is probably well before the SHTF situation becomes obvious to all. I may even remove less productive food plants like my siberian kiwi if it means I can cram in more productive food plants.

[jennyjj01]

I've just always grown my own tatties, I like having them

Perfectly sound reasoning, Lil. I wasn't trying to knock anyone else's choice.

The link Jansman sent us too pretty much rules out spuds for me. The house shades my growing area for a large part of the day.
I'll maybe try a small trug, but might have to move it around.

Grow Your Own Vegetables by Joy Larkcom has been my guide for years and includes a value to space guide. I too have limited growing space so my personal rules run as follows:

Normal times: Grow for fun & to learn. Grow things that might be expensive or which are simply not often seen in the shops. e,g, I grow Oca which we eat at Christmas but is never seen in the shops round here. Easy to grow but not a good return for the space committed. New potatoes are very expensive early in the season but a couple of pots of Rocket or Swift in a greenhouse is very achievable and makes for a treat. Maincrop needs too much room. Have you seen the price of a couple of sprigs of rosemary or parsley in the supermarket? I usually grow a selection of herbs, raspberries, tomatoes, beans, courgettes and a few squash. Anything that grows vertically (or can be made to grow upwards) is good in tight space.

SHTF times: I intend to convert the lawn and flower beds to produce food and aim to produce as much nutrition as possible in the space. This is when I would want to grow maincrop spuds, parsnips, carrots, beans and anything with a lot of nutrients/calories for the space needed and is otherwise not to be had. The hard bit will be realising I need to convert the lawn (& persuade the family) in time to plant which is probably well before the SHTF situation becomes obvious to all. I may even remove less productive food plants like my siberian kiwi if it means I can cram in more productive food plants.

Thanks GillyBee. Ebook downloaded.
Well to the extent that these are 'normal times' I'm in 'start to learn' mode, so I probably should gives spuds a go. When SHTF, I'll have to find some moss recipes if I'm to produce food from my lawn

Meanwhile.... I think I might have drowned my tomato babies. They got a lot of rain while they were briefly uncovered.

[jansman]

It takes a year or two to know what works on your ground. Most are not blessed- or cursed- with a large tract of land. Work with what you have.

[diamond lil]

Ty Jansman. Pity. The only other way I can think of then, is to buy a biggish storage box thing and put the tatties in tubs on the top. They'd be in the sun if they were higher than next door's fence.

[jansman]

Jenny.Your tomatoes shouldn’t be anywhere near rain yet! They need a constant growing temperature of 15 c minimum,or you’ll negatively check their growth .I believe you are growing outside,so they won’t do well exposed yet.‘Hardening off’ shouldn’t happen ‘til early May,really.
Keep them moist,but not ‘wet’,or you’ll run the risk of ‘damping off’ - it’s a fungal thing that makes your seedlings disappear overnight!- and make sure they have airflow.It’s a bit like making sure you take vegetables out of supermarket plastic so they don’t sweat.

[jennyjj01]

Jenny.Your tomatoes shouldn’t be anywhere near rain yet! They need a constant growing temperature of 15 c minimum,or you’ll negatively check their growth .I believe you are growing outside,so they won’t do well exposed yet.‘Hardening off’ shouldn’t happen ‘til early May,really.
Keep them moist,but not ‘wet’,or you’ll run the risk of ‘damping off’ - it’s a fungal thing that makes your seedlings disappear overnight!- and make sure they have airflow.It’s a bit like making sure you take vegetables out of supermarket plastic so they don’t sweat.

Doh!
Thanks Jansman.
They are in little pots on a tray and I'd put them in my Poly tent greenhouse. Unfortunately they had an hour or to out in the open and the compost got saturated. Made them wilt and look pretty sickly I should have known better.
So, I popped the tray in my electric propagator, with the plastic lid off, still inside the greenhouse, so that they get some sun and a chance for the soil to dry out a bit. I think most of them recovered a bit, but it's touch and go.
I'm hopeful that I can be disciplined enough to get and keep the moisture level right until their final home. Going to tool up with soil moisture and PH sensors. Probably need alarms to stop me neglecting them again.

Most are not blessed- or cursed- with a large tract of land. Work with what you have.

With that in mind, I did a bit of a survey and realised that there are a few places where planters can catch sun and not look out of place. Project for Spring will be Sunmapping my garden properly
Big seed order placed! More for me to torture



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