Home Solar System

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jennyjj01
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Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:09 pm

Re: Home Solar System

Post by jennyjj01 »

TheOldHObbit wrote: Sat Oct 15, 2022 9:03 pm
Yorkshire Andy wrote: Fri Oct 14, 2022 9:42 pm Just remember fuse it fuse it and fusebox everything ..

When you see how hot a big battery can get wires you'll get why it needs fusing :lol:


Also make sure that inverter cables are crimped properly
I hope I have done enough for the fuses, I have a 200amp at the battery and an inline fuse from the PV panels of 30amp 1000v. When I have the stuff mounted on the board, and the battery where I want it, I will order pre-made heavy duty cables at the right length. This is all new to me and electrics are certainly not my strong point, but hopefully I have judged it about right. My run from the panels to the controller is about 5m so I have ordered 6mm for the job. Thank you all for your responses........
Battery fuse depends on your max potential battery load. Guessing it's a 12v system, 200A will be enough for load of 2600W or so. if your max realistic load is less than that, then reduce that fuse down accordingly. E.g for a 1000W inverter that might get max loaded at 1500W, so fuse becomes 1500/13=120A
In reality, I'd suggest a lower value than load might dictate. In that case maybe 80A. Fuses can carry a bit more current than their rating. Besides a short circuit that can blow 100A would make a big bang at the weakest point. I dread to think whether your short circuit necklace would evaporate before your 200A fuse blew. I've seen what a car battery and a careless spanner and wedding ring can do.

As to fusing the panels... Someone will shoot me down here, but why bother??? If they can deliver a max of 30A, you will have provisioned cable able to carry 30A and short circuit condition could only get 30A. AIUI, Panels don't get damaged by short circuits.
As I discovered, Inverter cables need to be fat and low resistance, not just because of the heat they waste, but because if they can drop a volt each, even without getting warm, they can trip the inverter under voltage protection (10V in my case). Personally, I provisioned these generously, to allow for expansion. There are all sorts of loss/metre calculations and stats and its a trade off between the price of copper and the energy loss you can afford to make. Plus you don't want them to overheat.

YorkshireAndy's the go to guy for the details of fusing, but watch him. He makes you buy stuff :D :D

As Yorkshire Andy indicated, the quality of the crimping is as important as the cable itself. Also, get your custom battery cables with the right sized holes. Many are 10mm where you should have 8mm. I like to use split washers under any connecting nuts especially the ones on the inverter.
Graceful Degradation! Prepping's objective summed up in two words. Turning Disaster into Mild Inconvenience by the power of fore-thought

Not Feeling Optimistic. Let me be wrong
Yorkshire Andy
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Re: Home Solar System

Post by Yorkshire Andy »

The fusing should be protecting the lowest rated item in that stretch it's ok having 200a fuse on batteries but a 0.5mm2 cable tagged off this only has a capacity of about 11a .... = Big risk of fire in the event of a fault
If your roughing it, Your doing it wrong ;)

Lack of planning on your part doesn't make it an emergency on mine
jennyjj01
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Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:09 pm

Re: Home Solar System

Post by jennyjj01 »

Yorkshire Andy wrote: Sat Oct 15, 2022 11:46 pm The fusing should be protecting the lowest rated item in that stretch it's ok having 200a fuse on batteries but a 0.5mm2 cable tagged off this only has a capacity of about 11a .... = Big risk of fire in the event of a fault
Never really thought of it like that. So, for example 200A fuse just as the fat cable heads off from the battery to the inverter, but then something like 30A just as the thinner cable leaves the inverter, off towards the controller? Plus individual fuses on each battery rated at their contribution.

What did you think of NOT fusing solar panels? Or do you just do it for completeness?

Andy, you use those multi way fuse boxes. What multitude of things do you have tagged off? Lights? chargers? 12V tv? Do those fuse boxes have a commonned up side built in?
Graceful Degradation! Prepping's objective summed up in two words. Turning Disaster into Mild Inconvenience by the power of fore-thought

Not Feeling Optimistic. Let me be wrong
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steptoe
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Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2022 5:15 pm

Re: Home Solar System

Post by steptoe »

TheOldHObbit wrote: Sat Oct 15, 2022 9:03 pm
Yorkshire Andy wrote: Fri Oct 14, 2022 9:42 pm Just remember fuse it fuse it and fusebox everything ..

When you see how hot a big battery can get wires you'll get why it needs fusing :lol:


Also make sure that inverter cables are crimped properly
I hope I have done enough for the fuses, I have a 200amp at the battery and an inline fuse from the PV panels of 30amp 1000v. When I have the stuff mounted on the board, and the battery where I want it, I will order pre-made heavy duty cables at the right length. This is all new to me and electrics are certainly not my strong point, but hopefully I have judged it about right. My run from the panels to the controller is about 5m so I have ordered 6mm for the job. Thank you all for your responses........
Hi if electrics are not your strong point make sure you get someone to check it all over who is a sparks because well i learnt first hand what can go wrong and i got lucky when i was cutting a cable to length that the fact i was wearing rubber shoes but on a alli ladder and it was only my knee that tapped the ladder that casued a short and i was lucky i was using rubber grip cutters to it just threw me off the ladder and even luckier was the fact it did not damage my pacemaker , i have worked in the building trade my whole life and when fitting kitchens people would say can you just move that socket and so on an i alway said get sparks but well i never listened to my own advice when wanting to just raplce a badly fitted light in out back porch area i wanted nice led light instead of the old tube and well wanted to tidy the wires in to a nice little box i got very very lucky so please if you are not a sparks ask one to check the work over before you try it , also you may need to for the house insurance to because if your house went up and the fire brigade could point ot something you had done it may void that .

I would also say s well listen to Andy he really does know a thing or 2 and saved me wasting money
jennyjj01
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Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:09 pm

Re: Home Solar System

Post by jennyjj01 »

GillyBee wrote: Sat Oct 15, 2022 11:48 am Andy: What would you suggest as a good fusing arrangement for a 400W design charging multiple 7AH AGM batteries? Any particular products you would recommend?
An interesting choice of battery size. Something like a motorbike or golf cart battery? I saw originally that you were speccing out a 100W starter for use with car batteries.

May I ask what steered you to that size rather than, say small or large car batteries or the more stupidly expensive LiFePOs?
Was it about the 'luggability' aspect where these would be so easy to pop off the system and take to where the load is, rather than being constrained by cabling to 'a big cupboard'.
Or maybe about extendability or the ability to adapt. Maybe you just found a good source?
I can see how that would be a good idea in a few ways and now you've put the idea in my head, I might get one for my 25W shed panel which is redundant at the moment.

I'm really enjoying seeing how various members evolve their systems and adopt each-other's ideas.
Graceful Degradation! Prepping's objective summed up in two words. Turning Disaster into Mild Inconvenience by the power of fore-thought

Not Feeling Optimistic. Let me be wrong
jennyjj01
Posts: 3571
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:09 pm

Re: Home Solar System

Post by jennyjj01 »

steptoe wrote: Sun Oct 16, 2022 8:42 am
Yorkshire Andy wrote: Fri Oct 14, 2022 9:42 pm Just remember fuse it fuse it and fusebox everything ..
Hi if electrics are not your strong point make sure you get someone to check it all over who is a sparks ...
if you are not a sparks ask one to check the work over before you try it , also you may need to for the house insurance to because if your house went up and the fire brigade could point ot something you had done it may void that .

I would also say s well listen to Andy he really does know a thing or 2 and saved me wasting money
What they said!
Don't take safety advice off loons like me :lol: unless you need more excitement in your life.
I can give you illustrations of how not to do it.

Coming soon, the report on my 'Suicide Cord' adventure. :lol: :lol: :lol:

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=youtube+suici ... mDiwOvPWHQ
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=youtube+suici ... hDnp4_--9E
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=youtube+suici ... kjpS1vfGio
Last edited by jennyjj01 on Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
Graceful Degradation! Prepping's objective summed up in two words. Turning Disaster into Mild Inconvenience by the power of fore-thought

Not Feeling Optimistic. Let me be wrong
Yorkshire Andy
Posts: 9073
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 4:06 pm

Re: Home Solar System

Post by Yorkshire Andy »

jennyjj01 wrote: Sun Oct 16, 2022 7:55 am
Yorkshire Andy wrote: Sat Oct 15, 2022 11:46 pm The fusing should be protecting the lowest rated item in that stretch it's ok having 200a fuse on batteries but a 0.5mm2 cable tagged off this only has a capacity of about 11a .... = Big risk of fire in the event of a fault
Never really thought of it like that. So, for example 200A fuse just as the fat cable heads off from the battery to the inverter, but then something like 30A just as the thinner cable leaves the inverter, off towards the controller? Plus individual fuses on each battery rated at their contribution.

What did you think of NOT fusing solar panels? Or do you just do it for completeness?

Andy, you use those multi way fuse boxes. What multitude of things do you have tagged off? Lights? chargers? 12V tv? Do those fuse boxes have a commonned up side built in?

Well if the panels develop a fault .... The other panels in the system will follow the path of least resistance...

https://www.explorist.life/how-to-fuse- ... t-need-to/


If you've gone for the standard mc4 connections bathe fuses are literally plug and play

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/203307375680 ... R7SV8oH8YA
If your roughing it, Your doing it wrong ;)

Lack of planning on your part doesn't make it an emergency on mine
jennyjj01
Posts: 3571
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:09 pm

Re: Home Solar System

Post by jennyjj01 »

Yorkshire Andy wrote: Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:30 am
jennyjj01 wrote: Sun Oct 16, 2022 7:55 am What did you think of NOT fusing solar panels? Or do you just do it for completeness?

Well if the panels develop a fault .... The other panels in the system will follow the path of least resistance...

https://www.explorist.life/how-to-fuse- ... t-need-to/


If you've gone for the standard mc4 connections bathe fuses are literally plug and play

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/203307375680 ... R7SV8oH8YA
Thanks Andy, that makes sense. Fuse them where they are in parallel.
However, since each panel has a backcurrent diode, and no moving parts, it would need to be some weird sort of fault for a panel to present a short circuit. I won't be bothering to fuse mine in spite of your sexy eBay link. £10 indeed!!!
That doc does make the good point of needing a PV isolator switch. I will get one and another for my battery to controller. Since most of my wiring and switching is based on domestic wiring products, what would you think of something like a cooker type switch?
https://www.screwfix.com/p/british-gene ... hite/91193
Your chance to get me to buy something else :)
Graceful Degradation! Prepping's objective summed up in two words. Turning Disaster into Mild Inconvenience by the power of fore-thought

Not Feeling Optimistic. Let me be wrong