Bugging out in the UK

[grenfell]

Isn't the elephant in the room something about what would happen if Putin made good on his threats, at least with conventional weapons, and targetted the UK? Of all the unlikely things, its the *most* unlikely, but as grenfell just wrote, its a thought experiment. The last time we were in danger at that level by another state was in WWII, and there were evacuations of hundreds of thousands of children. Only a year ago, we were seeing an even bigger wave of evacuations from Ukraine, firstly to the west of the country and then flooding out all over the world.

What implications for this thread? You'd probably be able to take one bag with you, so your clothes, and what you can wear and sew into your clothes, would be crucial. I don't have a list I can write up right now, this really *is* a thought experiment, but between my ordinary hotel bag and the work I've done in organising preps and ordinary belongings, I could throw something together pretty quickly.

I tend to feel the room is getting crowded with the herd of elephants. If it's a biological attack or event such as the last pandemic the whole question of bugging out/running away might be moot. Did anyone bug out because of covid or if they did just when did they bug out . The virus was effectively almost everywhere and had probably overtaken any plans for a bugout .
With regards to lists and spreadsheets we don't do that and anyway all our lists would be pretty similar I would think. Like you we could pack quickly as it's all generally to hand.

[Frnc]

We should compare lists. Mine is on spreadsheets so it's tricky, I can only do screenshots.

On the spreadsheet I can sort by weight, grouped in Location (eg front left pannier) or Category (eg fire).

I have no lists for this particular issue nor spreadsheets

I'm willing to think about it though! So, what would I take, if I had a couple of hours notice of such an evacuation?
- the gold that I have. Not very much - some family wedding rings, a 21st birthday present that was a bracelet. I have much more silver and I'd wear all the wearable stuff too. I have some PMs in coin form, and I *might* try to take that, but it's about survival, isn't it. I might place their container into the back garden, inconspicuously, in case I made it home.
- water, as many half litre bottles as I could manage. I'm imagining a train stuck on sidings for 24 hours ... you couldn't manage to keep your water for yourself, you'd be forced to share, I think. Lifestraw and purification tabs.
- food. It would be a juggling act between energy and protein, plus you know your own body, eg fatty foods give me an upset stomach.
- I *would* take my external hard disc drive, because I'd be hoping that life would go back to normal. I'd want my kindle and my phone, and their chargers - the use of a phone has been really noticeable for Ukrainians, civilian and military. Financial information on a flash drive, and another flash drive of all the genealogical work I've done. Personal choice, nobody shoot me, and its only a flash drive!
- papers and ID - passport, driving licence, bus pass (has a picture), blood donation card - that might prove handy
- a couple of my single AA battery torches, with spare batteries and a charger. Ukrainian camps have a single room where its possible to charge phones, I've read.
- hygiene equipment. Toilet paper, hand gel, wipes, a few masks.
- I have a little over the shoulder bag, like a rip-off molle, which contains a first aid kit. Pick up and go.
- whatever money I've got in the house, including loose change, best not to start with the notes if possible.
- no matter what season it is, warm clothes. And cool clothes. And sunglasses. Nobody dreamt the Ukrainians would still be battling on a year later.
- I don't have particularly hi-tech clothes, frankly its an area I've skimped on. I'd take the most useable I've got.

Sounds good. I have copied two columns of my spreadsheet so I'll post it here

Bit of a mess, but I think most of my stuff is listed here, not the weights, locations, not the long term bag contents.
I have separate lists of what to grab depending on whether it's summer or winter
Kelty = rucksack
some items listed twice as one entry is category and the other is where they are. This mainly applies to two lime-coloured bags and a plastic tub containing small items.

iPhone
head torch on bed
keys
1.2 litre water? There is already a soft 1 litre bottle of water in the Kelty
shoulder bag(s) with wallet, bluetooth earphones, USB-micro lead, USB-C lead, iPhone lead, documents and passport, iPhone earphones
map case with maps and compass

water Sawyer micro filter
water Lifestraw
water water puri tabs in small tub + plus more in bags
water soft water bottles x 3 (Evernew 33g, platypus 27 x 2 g, big 68g )
Water Tubes for Lifestraw and Sawyer

var Trekking pole(s) (NEED ONE FOR TENT!), spare rubber tips. 180g each

tools medical superglue (can also suture wounds)
tools paracord
tools Swiss army knife
tools shovel/trowel
Tools Impact adhesive
tools tent repair kit
Tools zip ties
tools Leatherman Rebar
tools field knife Mora Companion

shelter quilt
shelter Sleeping bag (pied)
Shelter small tent pole
shelter Foam sit mat blue
shelter Geertop tent
Shelter tent pegs
shelter air bed Uberlite
shelter footprint (plastic sheet)
shelter closed cell sleeping mat

navigation Reading glasses in case
navig/power Apple charging plug + cable
navig/power solar charger/powerbank + lipo bag+ USB plus iPhone lead/cable
navig other maps
navig x3 magnifier + batteries lime

misc Small Tub includes impact adhesive, shoegoo, basically it’s all repair stuff and to protect bag from corners of metal tubes

medical/fire chapstick
Medical Imodium in toilet bag in kelty left pocket, in lime bag in Kelty lid
medical Sun cream
Medical Midge net
Medical Nail scissors
Medical Breathing masks
Medical First aid kit
medical insect repellant with gaffa

light mini torch, add to whistle landyard glasses screwdriver
light headtorch batteries (small tub) + £1 coin to open torch
light Petzl mini head torch
light solar camping lamp

hygeine toilet bag
hygeine Wash kit, toothbrush, toothpaste
hygeine Nail file

food freeze dried meals cals 365 + 385 +589 ie about two days at a push
food Seven Oceans ration pack 9 x 271 cals = 3 days at a push

fire credit card magnifier, chapstick, compass mag, sliding mag
fire 3 x mini bic lighters 24g

cook freezer bags
cook gas Primus 100g
cook 1100 Ti pot/mug
cook Soto Wind stove (in titanium pot) claimed weight is 86g incl 4 flex pot support
cook Pot hanging chain
cook 2 sporks + spatula
cook stand 0.025
cook scrubber in Ti mug

Comms notebook and pens, manuals, laminated map pens :2 black one red staedtler lumocolour permanent, pencil

Clothing boxers, mid season hiking socks, ua socks x 2, cloth, charger plug Yellow dry bag
Clothing Winter clothes bag
Clothing Insulated jacket plus hat & gloves
clothing poncho
clothing Flux jacket (waterproof)
clothing Windproof jacket
clothing Boots

accessories/navigation Shades, polarised
accessories snow and mud tips for poles, normal tips 1 pr

accessories Lime bag containing 12 x AAA batteries, Carson magnifier (uses AAAs), water puri tabs, Swiss army knife 50g, 4 x lighters, windproof matches, chapstick, meds, Imodium, 1Pkt tissues, mini carabiner.

Lime bag (UL) in Kelty lid has USBC cable, iPhone cable, micro USB cable, card magnifier, Petzl mini head torch + 13 x batteries, 4 x Duracell AAA batteries, small magnifier + 6 x 1220 batteries, 4 x 399/395 loupe batteries

Big sack liner
microfibre cloth?

[Frnc]

Isn't the elephant in the room something about what would happen if Putin made good on his threats, at least with conventional weapons, and targetted the UK? Of all the unlikely things, its the *most* unlikely, but as grenfell just wrote, its a thought experiment. The last time we were in danger at that level by another state was in WWII, and there were evacuations of hundreds of thousands of children. Only a year ago, we were seeing an even bigger wave of evacuations from Ukraine, firstly to the west of the country and then flooding out all over the world.

What implications for this thread? You'd probably be able to take one bag with you, so your clothes, and what you can wear and sew into your clothes, would be crucial. I don't have a list I can write up right now, this really *is* a thought experiment, but between my ordinary hotel bag and the work I've done in organising preps and ordinary belongings, I could throw something together pretty quickly.

I tend to feel the room is getting crowded with the herd of elephants. If it's a biological attack or event such as the last pandemic the whole question of bugging out/running away might be moot. Did anyone bug out because of covid or if they did just when did they bug out . The virus was effectively almost everywhere and had probably overtaken any plans for a bugout .
With regards to lists and spreadsheets we don't do that and anyway all our lists would be pretty similar I would think. Like you we could pack quickly as it's all generally to hand.

I've already posted 2 or 3 scenarios when I would bug out. Main two are government advice/order, or armed looter gang about to invade. The government isn't going to tell people to evacuate to a camp for a pandemic. They might for a biological/radiological/chemical/nuclear attack, I really have no idea. They tell us to be prepare to evacuate. They must have scientists advising them.

[grenfell]

Oh yes I understand that and I'm not saying you're wrong or trying to be argumentative. And as you say the government would be highly unlikely to order an evacuation for a pandemic which does raise a question. Not so much how or when to bug out but whether to . I appreciate it's going to be different for one person to another but in any plan is there a section labelled "not worth making the effort" ?

[Arzosah]

Isn't the elephant in the room something about what would happen if Putin made good on his threats, at least with conventional weapons, and targetted the UK?

I tend to feel the room is getting crowded with the herd of elephants.

That's absolutely blissful, I have such a vivid image in front of me

Frnc - that's quite a list, I like it! Forgot I have a couple of head torches now, that would be useful to bring them.

grenfell - very interesting, a section entitled "not worth making the effort". I suppose that divides into two sections: regional events that mean I'm safe if I stay tucked up in my house (like, 7/7, or the flooding of the Somerset levels - both catastrophic in their own way, but neither of them meaning its necessary for someone in Sussex or Kent to bug. The other section *might* be things that are so big that they're unavoidable: yes, if Putin went nuclear, or a dinosaur killer was confirmed on the way (though even in that case, I'd move away from the coasts).

What were you thinking yourself about not making the effort?

[grenfell]

I suppose any event where there's a likelihood of it all ending badly would or could fall into that catagory. Take a potential nuclear strike . Perhaps Putin is planning it . Now would be a good time to go , a few days beforehand much less so. There's a chance you might get out of the country but if that chance is very slim and the choice is dead at home or dead in a field...
Generally I'd say also any slow crash type event but again that's not black and white. Take anexample from history , 1930's the mid west dustbowl . Didn't happen overnight but over time people left. Simiarly and closer people leaving places like Syria over the timespan of the wars over there. Does that count as bugging out where you put up with things for perhaps years before making a move.

[Frnc]

https://www.cdc.gov/chemicalemergencies/evacuate.html

"Evacuate In a Chemical Emergency

Some chemical emergencies, such as a train derailment or terrorist attack, may make staying put and sealing off your space (sheltering-in-place) dangerous to you.

It may be safer for you to leave the area of danger (evacuate). You may need to go to an emergency shelter after leaving the area of danger.

What does Evacuate mean?

“Evacuate” means to get away from danger. It means the area or building is not safe for you stay in during a chemical emergency. You must leave and go to a shelter or other place outside of the area so you may stay as safe as possible until the emergency is under control.
Listen to the radio, television, or your mobile news app, or follow instructions in text alerts to find the nearest shelter and go there."

[Frnc]

https://www.cdc.gov/nceh/radiation/emer ... uation.htm

"In a radiation emergency:

Get inside a building and take shelter for at least 24 hours.

Stay inside to reduce your exposure to radiation.

Stay tuned for important information about how to keep you and your family safe."


"When to Evacuate

Each situation will be different. Emergency officials consider many factors to make sure that it is safe to evacuate. Evacuation decisions will be based on wind speed and direction, the size and extent of the disaster, the radiation levels, and whether or not roads and structures are damaged.
Emergency officials will tell you when to go to an emergency shelter, where the shelter is located, and the safest route for travel. Act quickly and follow instructions. Each situation will be different, and emergency officials will give you the best information to protect yourself and your loved ones.
Turn off the air conditioner, heater, or ventilation system to your house and close and lock all windows and doors before you leave, if you have time.
If evacuating by car, keep the windows closed and the ventilation system turned off.
Local emergency officials have plans to help those who do not have access to transportation. Transportation will be provided to evacuate people from dangerous areas."

[Frnc]

https://www.ready.gov/evacuation

"Plan to Evacuate

Many kinds of emergencies can cause you to have to evacuate. In some cases, you may have a day or two to prepare while other situations might call for an immediate evacuation. Planning is vital to making sure that you can evacuate quickly and safely no matter what the circumstances."

https://www.ready.gov/kit

"Basic Disaster Supplies Kit

To assemble your kit store items in airtight plastic bags and put your entire disaster supplies kit in one or two easy-to-carry containers such as plastic bins or a duffel bag.

A basic emergency supply kit could include the following recommended items:

Water (one gallon per person per day for several days, for drinking and sanitation)
Food (at least a several-day supply of non-perishable food)
Battery-powered or hand crank radio and a NOAA Weather Radio with tone alert
Flashlight
First aid kit
Extra batteries
Whistle (to signal for help)
Dust mask (to help filter contaminated air)
Plastic sheeting and duct tape (to shelter in place)
Moist towelettes, garbage bags and plastic ties (for personal sanitation)
Wrench or pliers (to turn off utilities)
Manual can opener (for food)
Local maps
Cell phone with chargers and a backup battery

Additional Emergency Supplies
alert - warning

Since Spring of 2020, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) has recommended people include additional items in their kits to help prevent the spread of coronavirus or other viruses and the flu.

Consider adding the following items to your emergency supply kit based on your individual needs:

Masks (for everyone ages 2 and above), soap, hand sanitizer, disinfecting wipes to disinfect surfaces
Prescription medications. About half of all Americans take a prescription medicine every day. An emergency can make it difficult for them to refill their prescription or to find an open pharmacy. Organize and protect your prescriptions, over-the-counter drugs, and vitamins to prepare for an emergency.
Non-prescription medications such as pain relievers, anti-diarrhea medication, antacids or laxatives
Prescription eyeglasses and contact lens solution
Infant formula, bottles, diapers, wipes and diaper rash cream
Pet food and extra water for your pet
Cash or traveler's checks
Important family documents such as copies of insurance policies, identification and bank account records saved electronically or in a waterproof, portable container
Sleeping bag or warm blanket for each person

Complete change of clothing appropriate for your climate and sturdy shoes
Fire extinguisher

Matches in a waterproof container
Feminine supplies and personal hygiene items
Mess kits, paper cups, plates, paper towels and plastic utensils
Paper and pencil
Books, games, puzzles or other activities for children"

[jansman]

https://www.ready.gov/evacuation

"Plan to Evacuate

Many kinds of emergencies can cause you to have to evacuate. In some cases, you may have a day or two to prepare while other situations might call for an immediate evacuation. Planning is vital to making sure that you can evacuate quickly and safely no matter what the circumstances."

https://www.ready.gov/kit

"Basic Disaster Supplies Kit

To assemble your kit store items in airtight plastic bags and put your entire disaster supplies kit in one or two easy-to-carry containers such as plastic bins or a duffel bag.

A basic emergency supply kit could include the following recommended items:

Water (one gallon per person per day for several days, for drinking and sanitation)
Food (at least a several-day supply of non-perishable food)
Battery-powered or hand crank radio and a NOAA Weather Radio with tone alert
Flashlight
First aid kit
Extra batteries
Whistle (to signal for help)
Dust mask (to help filter contaminated air)
Plastic sheeting and duct tape (to shelter in place)
Moist towelettes, garbage bags and plastic ties (for personal sanitation)
Wrench or pliers (to turn off utilities)
Manual can opener (for food)
Local maps
Cell phone with chargers and a backup battery

Additional Emergency Supplies
alert - warning

Since Spring of 2020, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) has recommended people include additional items in their kits to help prevent the spread of coronavirus or other viruses and the flu.

Consider adding the following items to your emergency supply kit based on your individual needs:

Masks (for everyone ages 2 and above), soap, hand sanitizer, disinfecting wipes to disinfect surfaces
Prescription medications. About half of all Americans take a prescription medicine every day. An emergency can make it difficult for them to refill their prescription or to find an open pharmacy. Organize and protect your prescriptions, over-the-counter drugs, and vitamins to prepare for an emergency.
Non-prescription medications such as pain relievers, anti-diarrhea medication, antacids or laxatives
Prescription eyeglasses and contact lens solution
Infant formula, bottles, diapers, wipes and diaper rash cream
Pet food and extra water for your pet
Cash or traveler's checks
Important family documents such as copies of insurance policies, identification and bank account records saved electronically or in a waterproof, portable container
Sleeping bag or warm blanket for each person

Complete change of clothing appropriate for your climate and sturdy shoes
Fire extinguisher

Matches in a waterproof container
Feminine supplies and personal hygiene items
Mess kits, paper cups, plates, paper towels and plastic utensils
Paper and pencil
Books, games, puzzles or other activities for children"

I am NOT taking the mickey about your issuing of government information- that is the truth.

I will take the mick of the above if people think it’s easy to cart that lot above to run away! I guess it is get it in home,stay in home. Anyone still got the booklet ‘Go in,Stay in, Tune in’ ? Yes, Stay In is what is really wanted by govt. and I don’t blame them really. Nearly 70 million folks wandering around blowing their ‘emergency whistles’ ain’t gonna do a lot of good. I still have our original ‘Protect And Survive’ booklet too from 1980. That too was about ‘staying home’. http://www.atomica.co.uk/main.htm

In fact ,on St George’s Day , Sunday 23 April, all of us smart - phoners will get an alarm sent from government. Here is the most dramatic link from The Sun but it says the same as all - I am taking the mick of that too .https://www.thesun.co.uk/tech/21798955/ ... alerts-uk/.

My wife has turned both our phones off from it!

In a roundabout way,such things point towards what has been mentioned here ; a nuclear threat.

Back in 1980 when I was in the services we had to do NBC training- Nuclear,Biological,Chemical- and even then,as a bunch of Boys ( and we were boys ) ,we all concluded that a strike from our Cold War Enemy at that time was The End. As a Corporal said to us ,and I’ll never forget, “if that happens,you may as well kiss your ar*es goodbye “.

Having *kit* for an emergency is a GOOD THING ,and basically it’s what you use everyday. Eating, drinking,washing,and heating. Indeed,if you get a nuclear *dose* - i.e. radiation sickness,then you won’t need food anyway!

I am currently having radiotherapy on my head ,in order to ‘Nuke’ the tumour on my brain. That radiation ( intense dose in a small area) makes me feel SICK! Eat? No! Tired like you can’t believe. Etc etc. Get a dose from a bomb,then trust me, you won’t care about emergency whistles and the latest tent - nor will you care about food!

So for us in our home, any threat of a nuclear war, power cut, food shortage, cold,heat, high winds,heavy rain,snow, BSE, Foot and Mouth diseases, COVID 23, drought, financial collapse, etc. we won’t be running away to … well, where? Our hotel bag is ready in case of fire ,flood or losing the roof in a gale,but that’s about it. That is covered by insurance! I’m not saying “No” to emergency equipment. I had ‘get home’ kit in my car when working so far away. Our daughters do too ,especially the eldest,as she travels up and down to Yorkshire regularly.

I must say that I agree with Arzosah and grenfell,who have both commented that society is *slowly* declining. Grenfell has also said that financial prepping is still the most useful type of ‘kit’. Tragedy and emergency takes many forms,and had I not thought of financial issues,we would now be in a mess. Indeed,our personal world could have collapsed.

However,one of my’practical jobs’ today is to sort out emergency lighting and power at home ,that is easy for my wife to access quickly. Also emergency water.We had a powercut this week,but not for long I am pleased to say. However,as we live on a steep hill,water has to be pumped up. That takes power. In the past,we had a five day power cut,and that meant water too! Without that we are dead.

Anyhow,that’s my two bob’s worth. All be good with your personal prepping and planning.