To quickclot or not?

[sniper 55]

I'm getting mixed messages about quickclot, many feel it's ok if your out in the wilds and a long way from help or the zombie apocalypse has started. But if your going to get profession help fairly soon your better off with direct pressure ect.
I'm also told the army are looking at not issuing it any more after stocks are used up.
I know it's tricky to remove from the wound at the hospital/med centre, and I know the early fine power was a nightmare to use, and heaven help if it got in your eyes, the granules were much better, and I'm told the gauze thingy is better agin.
What are people thoughts on carrying quickclot as part of your ifak??

[Yorkshire Andy]

Recent European resuss council guidelines (first aid at work) advocate cellox Gauze


Easier to remove as the gauze is impregnated

Early quick clot was exothermic and caused burns

We also covered z fold gauze for wound packing

And oales dressings

[featherstick]

Quikclot and similar depend very much on operating environment. You need to have:
- the right training to use it
- staff at the hospital who can remove it
- who also have the right training
- and the necessary tools/chemicals/meds

This isn't guaranteed in a peacetime civvy situation so scattering your quickclot around at the site of an RTA might well do more harm than good. I have decided to carry gauze as its more versatile and less dependent on many other factors outside your control.

[sniper 55]

It's looking like the gauze is the way to go then. Thanks for the replies.

[Yorkshire Andy]

How the trainer told us to use it was first apply a field dressing.. if pressure doesn't stop a major bleed and the field dressing becomes soaked then go to celox as if all the patients blood leaks out they are dead....

. You can't fix dead as easily as you can patch up / clean a celox filled wounds or torniqueted limb...


But you can't torniquet a neck wound or one in the torso or groin

The following shows animal testing if you don't like it don't watch it or complain but it shows a femoral bleed which you well really struggle to get enough pressure on the surface to stop bleeding or apply a cat


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LCSf5Asa8rc

[Lanky Yankee]

Not a fan of quick clot at all. I've used both quick clot and cellox gauze, and the gauze is much better. To that end 99% of all bleeding patients I go to, I can control the bleeding with gauze and pressure. Usually people take pressure off to early to see if it's stopped and that's why you never stop the bleeding. Take your time. Unless they have a major arterial bleed, the bleeding will stop with pressure. Even if they are on blood thinners. Use the money for more bandages and gauze.

Also anyone thinking of using quick clot an a rtc/major trauma, please don't. Ambulance staff have all that and need a good look at the injuries.

[Yorkshire Andy]

Well it took 20mins for the ambulance to get to our house about a month ago for a choking child.... I'd happily ram celox gauze into a catastrophic bleed or cat one as per my training in a ideal world the ambulance would arrive within a couple of minutes but as the 999 type TV programs show the ambulance services are at full stretch 24/7 I couldn't sit there and watch someone bleed to death without at least trying


Avoiding all politics we are slowly slipping into a third world health service. They are closing our local as in a 2 mins bike ride / 4 mine car ride 24 hour 7 days minor injury unit soon to a 15 hours a day service... after hours we will be 20+ miles to the closest open hospital / out of hours gp service...

Coupled with the fire service filling some gaps and more recently the police fire arms officers joining the team party!

When money allows I'm seriously looking into a off the beaten track style first aid course to pad out my basic 3 day faaw

[sniper 55]

Thanks for sharing the video mate, interesting to see the clot removal after, never seen that side of things beofre.
It took 50 minutes for an ambulance to arrive to a young man with a heart attack, we worked on the guy all that time, we shocked him and got him on oxygen (bag and mask with o2) we got him back a few times, sadly he died in hospital later. I wonder if thing might have been different if he'd got to hospital a lot quicker.
As you say if it's my family I'm going to get stuck in not wait till it's too late.
Thanks again for all the comments everybody.

[katilea]

I've got one called Styptic powder it was sold as a pet first aid item to stop bleeding if a nail or quick was accidently cut. Does anyone know if that would be safe to use on a human in an emergency?

Are any of the quick stop bleeding packs sold in human first aid kits also safe for pets or would you need to buy them seperately and keep a seperate first aid kit for each?

[Appin]

Very good point from Lanky Yankee:

" Usually people take pressure off to early to see if it's stopped and that's why you never stop the bleeding."

I know a doc whose work regularly involves sticking a big needle in an artery and to stop the bleeding afterwards they use pressure. His comment, 5 minutes pressure by the clock and then look do not slacken even for a moment. If still bleeding 10 minutes by the clock. Even if blood soaks through keep pressing.

In the old doctor in the house film there is a joke "what's the bleeding time - 4 fifteen sir!" Actually it takes blood 5 minutes to clot. Actually that 5 minute rule works on even simple cuts. Press and don't let go.